Hotel Tech Insider

SPEAKER_00:
Lack of integration doesn't fulfill the needs that we have. There's too many discrepancies between the statuses between the BMS and the housekeeping systems.

SPEAKER_01:
From Hotel Tech Report, it's Hotel Tech Insider, a show about the future of hotels and the technology that powers them. Today on the show, we have Sven Ephethyte, the head of hotel systems at Strawberry, one of the largest hotel companies in Scandinavia with more than 240 hotels and almost 17,000 employees. Sven is an expert at all things hotel technology and has been through several massive systems migrations. We get into the nitty gritty with Sven, talking about how his team has been busy migrating their PMS from on-premise to the cloud, adopting a new spa software, piloting housekeeping software, and adopting a new point of sale. Alright, Sven, thanks so much for joining us on the show today. I typically like to start out by asking about your background. The hotel tech industry is a little bit wacky. So how did you get here at just that high level? And how did you find your way into hospitality?

SPEAKER_00:
Oh, wow, that's a bit by coincidence. And back in 93, I was getting a job in one of our biggest properties more as a kind of before I started school, and I kind of stayed in industry for close to 30 years now. And I We've also done a survey in our tech department. I think it's up to 50, 60% of us in tech in our company that didn't ever think of the end up in tech at this stage. So quite coincidence.

SPEAKER_01:
Can you tell me a little bit more about Strawberry? I know you guys have rebranded in the last few years. Can you just talk about maybe the number of properties, market segments, geos, just to set us up to understand better some of the technology challenges that you're dealing with?

SPEAKER_00:
Yeah, we are approximately 230 hotels. four branded hotels with the Comfort, Karen Collection, Equality, and the Karen Hotels. And we also have the independent chain, Doric Hotel and Resorts, where we have 40, 45 really great properties, independent brands.

SPEAKER_01:
Are most of the properties, are they owned or managed? Or is there a mix of both?

SPEAKER_00:
There's a mix of both. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01:
And can you tell me a little more about your day to day and your job title and what you focus on in the business?

SPEAKER_00:
My title is head of hotel systems, but within the team we have the service owners for the fulfillment systems. I have what they're called application specialists who are the super users on the systems. I have project leads that are rolling out new hotels on the infrastructure and the whole budgeting on the tech stack. I have BRMs linking the tech and business together. So on the day-to-day, it's looking at what the business needs are and applying them within our team on how we can help the operations on a daily basis. Okay, that's the top line.

SPEAKER_01:
How is that tech team structure? It sounds like you have an application specialist for like a specific software system. Someone who's more of like a business analyst who's making sure that that system is achieving the business goals rather than being an expert on the future functionality. Are those scrum teams? So each software vendor that you have that's strategic to the business has that team that sits around them?

SPEAKER_00:
No, not now. After coming out from Corona, we had to organize and kind of stripped things down again. So we are building a bit up again, but we are divided in five big teams. You got the infrastructure, you got the architecture, we have security teams, we have resources, and also those supporting our, we have two kind of webs with the in-house, we have the web for the branded and we have the web for the independent.

SPEAKER_01:
Let's start getting into the tech stack. So I know that you guys have this monolithic system in Senium and you've kind of migrated since the Muse acquisition over. Can you talk about what that process was like? And obviously, I think Muse bought Senium probably while you were at Strawberry. Is that right?

SPEAKER_00:
Yes, I don't know the details. That's a bit higher than my pay grade. But we looked at some use before the Corona and it was one of the kind of the top PMS solutions. But working with Muse has been really kind of great experience for us because I think we were the first kind of enterprise customer. So I think that was one of the main things, besides from the economic side of it was about them being kind of a partner and opening up their product teams for us and discussing on the way forward. Obviously, they had a lot of features that we needed, but obviously some features that we didn't have. And over the last one and a half years, they have developed a lot together with us.

SPEAKER_01:
Can you maybe give some examples of those features, things that they didn't have, that you guys have had to kind of work with them strategically to build?

SPEAKER_00:
It's quite a lot on the revenue pricing side of it, on the group functionality. I think that's been some of the major part of single sign on. It's kind of a constant role that I have to kind of a dedicated service owner working with them with kind of our wishlist up against their roadmap.

SPEAKER_01:
Do you guys have a dedicated Slack channel or how does that collaboration happen between your wishlist and their roadmap?

SPEAKER_00:
Initially, we had, I think it was bi-weekly meetings with the product teams. Now it's bi-weekly with three of the representatives, the success manager, and we have a Slack channel for the rollouts.

SPEAKER_01:
You mentioned that you guys were already considering, you had looked at Muse pre-corona and were considering them while being on Zennium. What were the things that drew you to Muse back then and have those come to fruition through the rollout?

SPEAKER_00:
That was a bit before I joined the strawberry, but from what I understand was there a open API strategy and flexibility in the system. But obviously the API part of it, I think was one of the big things that they took into consideration.

SPEAKER_01:
Were you part of the use rollout strategy? How do you get from all hotels on this monolithic system of Centium to moving all of them into the SaaS world with Muse? That doesn't seem like a light lift.

SPEAKER_00:
No, that's been a really big program and been run from a consulate, that external consulate that we've, I don't know if we should call them external because it's been with us so many years. We had a rollout manager who's done a fantastic job. We recruited in 20 resources, so we have kind of trained the trainer principle. We built the training material. We used a software called Multimate, which is an app where you can do the trainings. We're taking benefit from the Muse University and the same as we've done for the Event Temple University. So it's been a really, really big program and a great, great team has been out of the hotels, training all the hotels, done the migration, and post-live support. So it's been a great journey that's coming to an end.

SPEAKER_01:
Is there anything that you know now that you wish you knew at the beginning of that journey?

SPEAKER_00:
Yeah. Communication. Getting both the hotels and the hq functions. Always up to date on what's going on keep everybody in lines. I'm the change management part of it going from an old legacy system over to new technology we tend to say it's going from a nokia sixty eight ten over to an iphone. And it's really fascinating how some hotels have gone 110% in, it's been anchored with the management group and they are really focused on the training, whilst others have been kind of, it's just a system change, we'll fix it. But then you get the support cases and you have to revisit the hotels. But most of our hotels are really taking it seriously.

SPEAKER_01:
What are the characteristic differences between the hotels that are doing well with the migration and the ones that are lagging? Is it a leadership issue with the general manager? Is it a team culture issue or anything that you've noticed that's kind of systematic patterns of a good adopter or shifter to one that needs work?

SPEAKER_00:
Well, we appointed kind of a hotel success manager and events success manager, but I think it really starts with the leader group and the general manager. The hotel systems are the strategic tools to making them succeed with their business. And for those who have that thought, they've had a much smoother transition than those who have a

SPEAKER_01:
What are the other strategic vendors in your tech stack that are those if you look across sales, marketing, operations, guest experience, what does that holistic tech stack look like today?

SPEAKER_00:
Well, today we have Muse as the PMS, we have Event Temple on the meeting and events side of it. So we have those on 160, 170 of the hotels. We have a Norwegian POS company called MUNU, rolled out to 170-180 hotels also. We just started with VITRIBE on the spa. I think we have them now at 20 of our hotels. We are piloting a new housekeeping solution, FlexKeeping. We started off with our largest property within Strawberry with 810 rooms, and it's going out for pilot number two in a week or two. We have Salesforce on the CRM part, OmniBoost on integrations. All in all, I think we have 180, 190 different smaller or bigger software solutions.

SPEAKER_01:
So I know EventTemple and Muse have an integration. Was the migration to Muse the catalyst for EventTemple?

SPEAKER_00:
Yes, because in Senium, the legacy system, we had sales and catering as it was kind of part of that model. So after starting up with Muse, we saw that we had to have a solution for the meeting and event sales and catering part of it. And we probably listed two different systems, one which was built kind of on top of Salesforce and Event Temple. So we had them running in parallel. And I remember the first hotel that we set up on event temple, which was a hotel called the hotel modern team, two years back, when they saw the UX on the system and the way to use it, they were really, really enthusiastic coming from also from another legacy system. So It was kind of an easy choice. And for us, we don't compromise on the security part on anything, because that's the basis of all systems that we have. But I think the partnership part of it is really, really important. And Event Temple has proven to give us attention. They are eager to learn how we run our business. We have bi-weekly meetings with their development team.

SPEAKER_01:
So when you're going through that evaluation process, trying software to hotels, how do you base the success? Is it based on like user feedback? Like you go do kind of like consumer insights studies with each group, each group that's using those at each hotel, or are you looking at revenue generation? Like how do you think about which one eventually wins and kind of moves forward?

SPEAKER_00:
We have a bit of an approach, really, because with 20,000 employees in Strawberry, I think we recruit somewhere between 6,000 and 7,000 new every year because of the tunnel. We nearly have to have a smooth onboarding process, getting the teams at the hotel confident in the systems. And especially for this part of it, we saw the onboarding process with EventTempo was smooth. It was... intuitive, and obviously we have in-house resources with the system owners, but that was a really important part of it. And also how we saw their partnership with Muse, because that's one of the most important, how they work together with the API. And when Muse does their development that affects Event Temple, they are quite quick on responding on it. And that's kind of the main factors for that cooperation.

SPEAKER_01:
Sounds like you guys have done a lot of pilots and switching of late. You had mentioned piloting a new housekeeping system. Can you talk about the kind of conditions that led you into this place where you're piloting a new system? Because presumably you're using one now where their pain points felt on property. Did something change with your existing vendor that led you to kind of explore new ones?

SPEAKER_00:
Yes, lack of integration doesn't fulfill the needs that we have. There's too many discrepancies between the status, between the BMS and the housekeeping systems. We have hotels that have got a report today, a hotel with 250 rooms, where the status differs between the two systems. So the lack of trust from the business side in what you see is the right status on the hotel. And we use a lot of time to investigate and try to sort out what was wrong in the integration and at one point you see that we have to look for an alternative and stability and helping the business achieve their business goals is kind of the main core we have to support them with systems that work. We looked into museum occupies, we used tech reports, looking at some of the ratings. We did reference calls with hotels that are using different housekeeping systems. And we started off with a pilot for flex keeping. And from day one, that system has been a hundred percent stable. And we only two, three weeks into the pilots and we're setting up on the second hotel in a week's time to pilots. Cause they come from another angle, if you can call it that.

SPEAKER_01:
What does the team look like around that pilot? Is there a representative or a point of contact on property? I imagine someone from FlexKeeping is watching this closely to make sure that everything goes well. How do you guys structure the evaluation and rollout phase? Because I imagine you're not putting together all these training materials. Obviously, FlexKeeping probably has their own training materials and education. But imagine not doing it like enterprise wide until the full rollout. So what does the team look like that's making sure that you don't just try the software, but you're set up for success on the ground on property with that new system that you're piloting?

SPEAKER_00:
Firstly, we had a discussion with the management of the hotel and getting them on board and then getting assurance that they were all in on piloting and giving us the KPIs and kind of identifying the success, what for them would be a success. Then we had, I think it was four representatives from FlexHeaping that were on site and did the training, four or five that were on site. I've been involved and we have the service owner from use has been involved and we have a dedicated project lead on the project who's following up the business case and looking at the KPIs and the success. We have a weekly meeting with FlexKeeping where they give us the feedback on the usage of the systems, they give us recommendations for improvements, how to use the system better. And at the end of the pilot, I think it's after three months, they will give us a case study on what benefits and KPIs we have achieved and the recommendations moving forward.

SPEAKER_01:
How quickly do you end up rolling out to the rest of the hotels after a pilot like that? Or how do you typically plan for something like that?

SPEAKER_00:
We have a lot of inpatient hotels out there, so we would have to maybe start in June. And our ambition is kind of have the trainer approach for it and build documentation together with FlexKeeping, obviously with their support on the back end of it. But that's what our project lead on this is working on now, how to have a rollout, what it could look like, the resources needed, and kind of when to start.

SPEAKER_01:
We haven't touched on guest experience. What is the kind of the guest journey look like at your hotels? I'm guessing maybe for a bed and breakfast, it's a little different than an 800 room hotel. And what tech is enabling that guest experience from contactless check-in to messaging apps to a dedicated hotel app? What does that stack look like?

SPEAKER_00:
Well, we have our own department called eBury who is working on the guest experience, which is a completely different department than we are. We are a really close corporation. We have our own developers on our web and our app, Mobile Keys. We're really working now on the guest journey, mapping the guest journey up against our new tech stack, what can be enabled through Salesforce, where we should use Muse, or are there other software solutions that we should use, both for the pre-stay, the in-stay, and when the guest is left, then we use something called Lupon as an MPS score. So we are kind of in also a transition there and building up our web, For the independent hotels, we're just releasing a new booking engine, which was developed partly internal, but with an external company.

SPEAKER_01:
Before we started recording here, you had talked about switching to a data warehouse and making sure that all the systems are basically connecting into the same data source. You're using over 100 software tools. What does that process look like and where are you guys in that journey?

SPEAKER_00:
We got quite far. We're getting really good data out of it now, but there's still a long way to go. We're working a lot on standardization coming out from, again, from the legacy system. I can't remember the number of rate codes we had. I think it was thousands of rate codes. So we have a standardization project to try and get both in the PMS and in the event tempo and in the POS. and getting that data into the data warehouse and helping all parts of the business getting the right data for making decisions. Getting data out now, just as an example for the F&B part of it, working with menu engineering, analyzing all parts of the data and doing adjustments and see how we can help the FMP outlets earn more money. It will help us in yielding in any part, but we have a dedicated team working on it, building the data warehouse, our own engineers, analytic capabilities. So that's really, really exciting. And we noticed kind of from our CFO and the business performance department that they are really good to get the data out, even more data out.

SPEAKER_01:
Anything else that you'd like to talk about on the data warehouse project in terms of some of the challenges or anything that you wish you knew going into that one that you know now?

SPEAKER_00:
I wish we had started with the standardization project before we started rolling out because we got some cleaning up to do and setting the standards and getting all the hotels to follow the standards.

SPEAKER_01:
Are you guys working with a third party to do that data warehouse? Is that a software vendor? Is that a service provider, IT consultancy? Who's doing that project?

SPEAKER_00:
We've had in-source resources and engineers who've been building it in-house.

SPEAKER_01:
So anytime you're thinking about solving a new problem, is it always a build versus buy? Because you have that engineering capacity for something like the flex keeping migration. Did you guys think about building stuff in house or are there certain projects where your engineers are kind of mandated to go after and everything else is buy?

SPEAKER_00:
I'm not before we have kind of a we call it project hope we have all kind of different capacities in the meeting and we get the input from the business from the head office. Based on needs and we discuss it is it something that we could build we look at the news marketplace for instance or is it even necessary to look at so we do kind of a screening before. But with Muse, I think they have a thousand apps or integration possibilities in the marketplace. And if we can't find it there, then we will kind of build it.

SPEAKER_01:
Obviously, there's a lot of talk in the industry about labor shortages, about the use of AI. Are there any big, meaty objectives or strategic objectives that is really kind of bleeding into your hotel systems division right now, as you guys think about the next 12 and 24 months?

SPEAKER_00:
We're looking really hard at the governance now that we've done the rollout. Obviously, we've got new hotels coming in, franchise hotels, and we've still got hotels on other PMSs that we have to migrate. But overall, it's kind of the support using... We've got a lot of documentation and using AI to get better support for the hotels and for our SOS support departments. Labor-wise, it's... become easier to kind of recruit also engineers and architects. So the architects has traditionally been a lot of consultants, but moving the more in-house.

SPEAKER_01:
When you mention using AI for the documentation, is that kind of like trying to have a central place to query product issues with like Muse and Event Tumble and FlexKeeping all within one kind of chatbot? Is that how you're thinking about it?

SPEAKER_00:
Yeah, because we can't think of the systems in silos. In my department, I have a role called the work process specialist. And that's defining the work process across the systems. Our big M&E hotels, they will be using both Muno and Muse and Event Temple, and also the payment part of it. So we need processes across the systems. And for the support cases are also root cause is maybe not in Event Temple, it could be in another system.

SPEAKER_01:
Any other high-priority business objectives right now?

SPEAKER_00:
Well, we're also rolling out Tri, but I don't think we've been into that one. The spa solution, which also has capabilities for more than just spa. Now for us now, it's more to dig into how we can utilize all the systems that we have and establish a good governance model and support model for the hotels.

SPEAKER_01:
So we've covered a lot of ground state. One thing that we always ask our guests is, what's one thing that you believe is true about hotel technology that you think most people in the industry would disagree with you about? Do you have any contrarian views? We're looking around the room at everyone in our space and you're like, you are all wrong about this.

SPEAKER_00:
I think that's from where we've been now is more the people around us underestimate the change moving into new tech stack. You kind of want to stay in the same workflow and the same processes that you've always been into, but adopting to new systems and the possibilities in a new tech stack is really, really underestimated. I think that's what I disagree because people underestimate what the possibilities are in a new modern tech stack.

SPEAKER_01:
Sven, this has been an incredible conversation. We've covered so much ground. Is there anything that you think we haven't touched on that is really critical to Strawberry right now or how you're viewing the market?

SPEAKER_00:
I think it's for us just to be more relevant for our guests more often. So that's using the text app to gain that.

SPEAKER_01:
Well, thanks so much, Sven. It's been great chatting with you. That's all for today's episode. Thanks for listening to Hotel Tech Insider produced by Hoteltechreport.com. Our goal with this podcast is to show you how the best in the business are leveraging technology to grow their properties and outperform the comp set by using innovative digital tools and strategies. I encourage all of our listeners to go try at least one of these strategies or tools that you learned from today's episode. Successful digital transformation is all about consistent small experiments over a long period of time. So don't wait until tomorrow to try something new. Do you know a hotelier who would be great to feature on this show? Or do you think that your story would bring a lot of value to our audience? Reach out to me directly on LinkedIn by searching for Jordan Hollander. For more episodes like this, follow Hotel Tech Insider on all major streaming platforms like Spotify and Apple Music.